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Post by aubrey on May 28, 2010 18:42:45 GMT
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Post by aubrey on May 30, 2010 12:24:43 GMT
No one's looked at it - I'm shocked.
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Post by riotgrrl on May 30, 2010 12:39:15 GMT
Aubrey, that's rotten. Sorry.
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Post by aubrey on May 30, 2010 15:38:55 GMT
In what way? Good tune, good words, good singing, good drumming... What more do you want? (And a video with him smoking a fag - come on!)
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Post by everso on May 31, 2010 0:06:49 GMT
Aubrey - it's a dirge. On the bright side - we probably won't have to be singing it for long.  |
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Post by aubrey on May 31, 2010 13:30:14 GMT
It's melancholic - acknowledging that we don't have much chance.
I will concede that he isn't a good singer: but he is a wonderful vocalist.
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Post by everso on May 31, 2010 15:15:50 GMT
What's the difference?
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Post by aubrey on May 31, 2010 18:18:21 GMT
A singer sings. A vocalist does something else with his/her voice. Bob Dylan is a vocalist, rather than a singer. So is Ray Davies, really. They do things that aren't singing, and that a singing teacher would slap their hands over, to get different effects.
Mark Smith in this sings a bit, but as singing it is technically so bad that you can't really call it singing. But it is effective.
Really, his only real talent as a singer is good timing. But he is a really good vocalist. But he does have an unmistakable voice; when he gives the microphone to someone else (at a concert) it will never sound right. No one else sounds right singing a Fall song. For one thing, they'll usually sing, which is not the way to approach a Fall song.
Also, he will never be out of tune because he is never really in tune. Like Dylan. (He is not really anything like Dylan, though.)
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Post by trubble on May 31, 2010 21:46:53 GMT
Aubrey. Are you in any way serious about liking this song?
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Post by aubrey on Jun 1, 2010 9:29:36 GMT
Oh, yes.
It's not something I'd play if I wanted to convince someone of the genius of The Fall, but it's ok.
Things I like:
I always like it when MES tries to sing - he can't, so it sounds touching - a different effect from proper singing.
I like the kazoo sound at the start - some early Fall songs used a kazoo, so it's kind of nostalgic.
I like the reference to Boar Ridge, and the line about not being at Stamford Bridge (bloody Southerners!), which is a similar sentiment to the line about being abroad in The Fall's Kicker Conspiracy.
I like the guitar at the end.
And I like the drums.
I am dead serious about the difference between vocals and singing, by the way; they're both techniques, and they're both very effective, when used properly. But they are very different. You get people who can sing, but are lousy vocalists, and the other way about. Some (a very few) people can do both. Peter Hammill, for one, and Dagmar Krause, and I think Diamanda Galas, though i don't know her that well.
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Post by Alpha Hooligan on Jun 1, 2010 9:41:02 GMT
Aubrey. Are you in any way serious about liking this song? Aubs is a shameless Mark E Smith fan whore...of course he likes it (in much the same way that I would consider a 3 minute audio recording of Frank Black eating salad to be a "masterpiece of genius-tastic proportions". AH |
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Post by aubrey on Jun 1, 2010 10:35:17 GMT
I also love the fact that he's smoking a fag in the video, so ensuring no TV broadcasts at all. This is what is being said about it on the Fall's official/unofficial (I can not remember which it is now) forum; it is by no means unanimous. (See if you can spot which one is me.) |
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Post by trubble on Jun 2, 2010 7:01:07 GMT
I think I spotted you! Good disguise. My favourite comment was "Has this thing gone viral yet?" ;D I asked if you were serious because (MES fan whoring aside) I cannot see any virtue in it at all and (MES fan whoring aside) am curious about what I might be missing. Perhaps it's relevant that I know nothing about The Fall except what you have told us and I haven't taken to them. The points about vocalist v singer are all well and good but the other people you use as examples vocalise poetry to music. This song is not poetry, or if it is it's bad poetry, or if it's not bad and I am just not getting it I would love to be enlightened. Actually, your post about Stamford Bridge being an important battle went somewhere towards doing that -- except that I don't believe they meant to be that incisive and you are being kind. See, I really don't understand what the song is. I was willing to reconsider its merits if it was a commentary or art installation but if it is supposed to be an anthem... Ed said: "We wanted to do something really anthemic to get people singing it and I think we’ve done that".Nope. You did not! The song doesn't speak ''footballish'' and that's a bit like writing Britan's new national anthem in esperanto.  |
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Post by trubble on Jun 2, 2010 7:10:46 GMT
Aubrey. Are you in any way serious about liking this song? Aubs is a shameless Mark E Smith fan whore...of course he likes it (in much the same way that I would consider a 3 minute audio recording of Frank Black eating salad to be a "masterpiece of genius-tastic proportions". AH Fair enough. Alph, have you have heard of Matthew's Celebrity Pixies Covers? Ike and Tina Turner - River Euphrates Allegedly he has the Bee Gees covering ''Wave of Mutilation''. Must. Find. Cannot. Live. Without. Hearing. That. |
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Post by aubrey on Jun 2, 2010 13:00:41 GMT
I don't think this is his best lyric, but it's ok. Generally his lyrics are amazingly good. The original lyric that the Boar Ridge one was reminiscent of was Pat McGatt. Pat McGatt, the very famous sports reporter is
talking......there.
FANS! ! ! "Remember, you are abroad!
Remember the police are rough!
Remember the unemployed!
Remember my expense account!"I don't think that lyrics work the same as poetry; MES' lyrics usually gets a lot of power from repetition. Like this, in a song that is meant to be a celebration of the world cup, he tosses in a reference to the Zulu War. I don't know how relevant it is, but it is a reminder that football - especially the world cup - is never just about football. The Fall's lyrics have covered all sorts of things, including battles; knowing Smith, the reference to Stamford Bridge could be deliberate (though I admit that it probably isn't - the soft southerners explanation is probably the one to go with). Fall lyrics here.(I have a habit, whenever certain things come up in conversation, of saying, "The Fall have a song about that." It is amazing how often I can say it, and how often I don't, when I can. He has a very wide range of subjects (they also did the only song that I know that was in favour of the task force and the Falklands War (the song is Marquis Cha Cha)). I also like the production of the world cup song. The Fall have had a studio wanting its name taken off a Fall record because the production was supposed to be so bad. It wasn't ; it was just The Fall. It was perfect. I do say though that this song isn't his best. It is a bagatelle. But it is also ok - nothing to be ashamed of. |
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Post by Alpha Hooligan on Jun 2, 2010 15:02:13 GMT
Trubb, there is not nearly enough throat wrenching screaming for a Pixies cover/parody. Chris Morris knows how it's done....
AH
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Post by everso on Jun 2, 2010 16:14:19 GMT
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Post by aubrey on Jun 2, 2010 16:37:59 GMT
I wrote that last one in a kind of trance (low blood pressure), and then went to bed for half an hour or so.
I'll play that Beach Boys song when I get home, Everso (but but but - The Fall have a song called "Levitate.")
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Post by swl on Jun 2, 2010 18:53:23 GMT
Oh thank God, somebody's done a worse world cup song than this
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Post by aubrey on Jun 3, 2010 17:44:33 GMT
Another fall football song (with another dig at Chelsea.
Part of this is used as the theme for the BBC results ptogramme on Saturday afternoons; oddly, as it could be read as a celebration of football hooliganism.
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