|
Post by Weyland on Jan 23, 2011 18:07:17 GMT
I was looking at this link that someone pointed out to me. The main message seems to be "ignorance is bliss". This "wind turbine with giant blades to power 10,000 British homes" is rated at 10MW (megawatts). That's 1kW per home. Your average kettle uses 1.8kW. Washing machine, 0.7kW. Microwave, 1kW. Dishwasher, 1kW. Toaster, 1kW. And so on. Conservative estimates. A single steam turbine at Drax Power Station generates 800MW. There are six of them. So by the site's logic, Drax powers 4,800,000 homes. Ferrybridge -- which I built with my bare hands -- has four 500MW steam turbines. So that's another 2,000,000 homes. They both have quick-start backup gas turbines (jet engines) to supply about 100MW more should the load demand it. They can all run at full load all the time if necessary. There are dozens of power stations like that in Britain. (Drax is the biggest.) A wind turbine only runs when the wind blows, and even then may not reach full load. And, by the way, they are much bigger than any steam turbine. That site, and many more "green energy" sites are not just spreading disinformation, they are lying. [/rant] [Disclaimer: I served my apprenticeship at the factory in Newcastle that made the steam turbines at Drax and Ferrybridge, and many other stations. Rolls-Royce took it over and apparently screwed up the pension fund (I haven't given up yet). Siemens owns it now. (The same factory was founded by the inventor of the modern steam turbine, Charles Parsons.)]
|
|
|
Post by everso on Jan 23, 2011 18:20:12 GMT
We have a wind turbine not far from where we live. It's right next door to the "park and ride" place (not unreasonably I suppose - both being sort of "green" so to speak). The other day I parked my car in the "park and ride" car park and walked the half hour or so to where the park and ride bus waits (it's a big car park ;D). Anyway, as I walked past the wind turbine I had the sudden thought: if those blades came loose and fell off, it would bloody-well cut me to pieces, let alone flatten quite a few cars.
I need to know before I park my car there again: are those blades screwed on tight?
|
|
|
Post by Weyland on Jan 23, 2011 18:28:22 GMT
We have a wind turbine not far from where we live. It's right next door to the "park and ride" place (not unreasonably I suppose - both being sort of "green" so to speak). The other day I parked my car in the "park and ride" car park and walked the half hour or so to where the park and ride bus waits (it's a big car park ;D). Anyway, as I walked past the wind turbine I had the sudden thought: if those blades came loose and fell off, it would bloody-well cut me to pieces, let alone flatten quite a few cars. I need to know before I park my car there again: are those blades screwed on tight? Don't worry, Ev. They use industrial-strength gaffer tape. (Generator steam turbines spin at 3000 rpm. They're contained within a thick steel casing and aren't sited near carparks.)
|
|
|
Post by everso on Jan 23, 2011 18:32:10 GMT
Apparently, upon Google investigation, this particular turbine provides 50% of the energy needed by the car park for lighting etc. No bad thing I suppose, but nevertheless, I was a bit freaked out by the thought of the blades crashing down on me.
|
|
|
Post by Weyland on Jan 23, 2011 18:43:13 GMT
Apparently, upon Google investigation, this particular turbine provides 50% of the energy needed by the car park for lighting etc. No bad thing I suppose, but nevertheless, I was a bit freaked out by the thought of the blades crashing down on me. I understand your concern. Can't be bad, though. How big is it? [Of course it doesn't need to be anywhere near the carpark to do that in any case.]
|
|
|
Post by everso on Jan 23, 2011 18:47:43 GMT
I couldn't estimate how big it is - I'm not very good at estimating heights. What I don't understand though is how come, when the air is still and there's hardly a breeze, the damn thing seems to be whizzing round? I mean, do they switch it on or something?
|
|
|
Post by Weyland on Jan 23, 2011 18:59:41 GMT
I couldn't estimate how big it is - I'm not very good at estimating heights. What I don't understand though is how come, when the air is still and there's hardly a breeze, the damn thing seems to be whizzing round? I mean, do they switch it on or something? There'll be hidden steam pipes to foster the illusion, using imported coal to fuel the made-in-Germany boilers. The wind turbine itself will have been made in Denmark, apart from the blades, which will be Dutch. If you think I'm kidding, you are mistaken. Don't worry though -- Britain has a post-modern Service- and Knowledge-based economy. Banking and Unemployment Statistics.
|
|
|
Post by Patrick on Jan 23, 2011 19:58:18 GMT
I love wind turbines!! Not necessarily from a "Green" point of view - I just think of all the crappy things mankind has dumped in the countryside over the years, at least these have a graceful beauty to them! Trouble is, they suffer from Sir Clive Sinclair syndrome! I.e: Had Sir Clive marketed the C5 electric car as a "Bit of fun" he would have had far more success with it. Instead of promoting it as a direct replacement to the car. Likewise, if they portrayed Wind Turbines as "A Little Extra" totop up the system - they might be more acceptable than the way they try and make them out as the answer to everything! Mind you (present company excepted) there is a certain element of the "when I drove past them, they weren't working" mentality about the turbine view, when it's also said that the UK is one of the windiest lands on the globe! A bit like the chap who writes into our local paper every now and then complaining that he never sees a cyclist on the cyclepath so ergo they should all be shut down! ;D
|
|
|
Post by Weyland on Jan 23, 2011 20:33:56 GMT
I love wind turbines!! Not necessarily from a "Green" point of view - I just think of all the crappy things mankind has dumped in the countryside over the years, at least these have a graceful beauty to them! I agree. The big ones are majestic. Entering the mouth of the Maas/Rijn at Hoek van Holland you see a lot of them -- powering the oil refineries I guess -- and some of them stand in a long row on an island in the middle of the seaway. Beautiful, especially when every one is spinning in a good breeze. Synchronised generation. And I remember topping a rise on the autobahn, eastbound through the Ruhr towards Kassel, and suddenly seeing a vast spread-out plain with a forest of wind-turbines, all turning. Magical. Spot on. That's all they are. You believe that? Our NHS, police, parliament, armed forces, unameit are also all "the envy of the world". Right? Even if it's true, you STILL need some proper power sources in case the wind doesn't blow. As they sing in The Good Ship Venus (by God you should've seen us) . . . The First Mate's name was Carter. By God he was a farter. When the wind wouldn't blow, And the ship wouldn't go, We got Carter, the farter, to start 'er.
|
|
|
Post by Weyland on Jan 23, 2011 21:16:54 GMT
~ ~ ~ While I'm here, this one was taken the day before, in London . . . I snapped the paparazza with my hidden camera.
|
|
|
Post by aubrey on Jan 23, 2011 22:17:00 GMT
Herzog's Signs of Life I think it is has a wonderful shot, a 360 degrees pan, full of windmills. I feel the same about wind turbines. Keith Roberts's Pavane as well, with the signallers - do you know that one, Weyland? It's a lovely image.
|
|
|
Post by Weyland on Jan 23, 2011 22:46:15 GMT
Herzog's Signs of Life I think it is has a wonderful shot, a 360 degrees pan, full of windmills. I feel the same about wind turbines. Keith Roberts's Pavane as well, with the signallers - do you know that one, Weyland? It's a lovely image. I do, I do, Aub! Know Pavane, that is. I can see that you're a man of some refinement. But I already knew that, git or no git. AND I agree about the bloody cous cous as well. I once had some in Morocco, where it supposedly came from in the first place. No better than cous bloody cous anywhere else. And the kebabs were mostly glistening gristle. The sweet mint tea? Vile stuff. Bleccch.
|
|
|
Post by Patrick on Jan 24, 2011 0:11:03 GMT
Wind turbines also work from an aesthetic point of view - or a "Designer/Perspective" point of view - I mean!* - There you've got acres and acres of bloody countryside all flat and wavy like - I mean! It's just crying out for some bloody horizontals to set it off innit? Or the sea? Eh? Miles an' miles of flat bloody blue stuff, all watery like - what better than a few sticky up bits to give it a bit of shape eh? ;D ;D
*(c)Alf Garnett 196something
|
|
|
Post by Weyland on Jan 24, 2011 12:22:42 GMT
Wind turbines also work from an aesthetic point of view - or a "Designer/Perspective" point of view - I mean!* - There you've got acres and acres of bloody countryside all flat and wavy like - I mean! It's just crying out for some bloody horizontals to set it off innit? Or the sea? Eh? Miles an' miles of flat bloody blue stuff, all watery like - what better than a few sticky up bits to give it a bit of shape eh? ;D ;D *(c)Alf Garnett 196somethingYou mean verticals, I dare say. I agree again. I like pylons as well, striding away into the distance. The add scale to the landscape. I also love the sight of a big power station such as Ferrybridge-C, under full load on a crisp and sunny winter's day, cooling towers billowing clouds of brilliant white steam. It looks like a vast ocean liner cruising across the Yorkshire plains. Magnificent. But I guess that might be a classic case of beauty in the eye of the beholder. I built the turbines. Yes, it IS just steam, good old harmless steam. (Actually water vapour, but steam in the divine afflatus of the Volksmond.) "Fiddler's Ferry", I hear you think, Jean & Alph, but the tower configuration there is not ideal. Still majestic, though, in the right weather conditions and from the right viewpoint. I've seen it billowing from the vicinity of The Bridge, on the way to the airport.
|
|
|
Post by Weyland on Jan 24, 2011 18:52:39 GMT
|
|
|
Post by Patrick on Jan 24, 2011 23:50:39 GMT
Yes! I meant "Verticals" As I typed I was thinking "Horizontal Landscape". As for pylons - there is a weird humanity about them - Viewed from a distance going towards a power station it's like seeing lots of skeletal animals heading towards a feeding area.
|
|
|
Post by aubrey on Jan 25, 2011 10:10:16 GMT
The way right wingers complained about Turbines as an eyesore, but have never complained about pylons in the same way: and they was they suddenly discovered that birds might be hurt: but only by turbines, not by anything else, was interesting. I like turbines and pylons, by the way.
VDGG recorded a recent LP in a studio next to a wind farm; at the end they made a special recording of the sound it made as you walked towards the studio, and put it at the start of the lp.
|
|
|
Post by everso on Jan 25, 2011 16:53:37 GMT
The way right wingers complained about Turbines as an eyesore, but have never complained about pylons in the same way: and they was they suddenly discovered that birds might be hurt: but only by turbines, not by anything else, was interesting. I like turbines and pylons, by the way. VDGG recorded a recent LP in a studio next to a wind farm; at the end they made a special recording of the sound it made as you walked towards the studio, and put it at the start of the lp. DO only right wingers complain about turbines? Surely there must be some left wingers that aren't that keen. Surely, the fact that you vote Conservative doesn't make you automatically anti-turbines.
|
|
|
Post by aubrey on Jan 29, 2011 11:37:52 GMT
I used to see stuff like that in the Telegraph a lot. And there is the Conservative thing of not caring for all that hippy stuff like conservation of energy and recycling, etc (though the person I know who is most against it is a Communist).
|
|
|
Post by everso on Jan 30, 2011 0:33:20 GMT
I used to see stuff like that in the Telegraph a lot. And there is the Conservative thing of not caring for all that hippy stuff like conservation of energy and recycling, etc ( though the person I know who is most against it is a Communist).well, there you go, see! You just can't trust a Commie.
|
|